We’ve covered most of Wes Anderson’s recent output, but we missed The Phoenician Scheme when it released in theaters. So we wanted to rectify that in between our holiday coverage, and give this espionage/business caper its proper due. Here we talk about the overly complicated scheme, Benicio del Toro as frontman, the phoenix rising of Michael Cera, and a whole lot more as we try to parse the symmetrical orientation of Anderson’s film. We’re also drinking Ommegang’s Ommegeddon, a Brett Saison Ale!
Approximate timeline
0:00-12:00 Intro
12:00-20:00 Beer talk
20:00-end The Phoenician Scheme
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Transcript – The Phoenician Scheme (auto-generated)
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0:02
Bless us unto these thy holy years.
What’s this about?
To receive through their merciful bounty we humble ourselves.
Thus thou not fear God for thee in thy name.
Amen.
Amen.
Are you against slavery and the Bible?
0:19
It’s damnable to hell.
I believe they receive a small stipend.
1:03
None.
Hey, guys, welcome back to the Blood and Black Crime Podcast.
I’m Ryan from closeplotation.com and I’m joined with my Co host Mark.
How’s it going?
Hey, we’re doing pretty well and I’m glad to be back.
Took a week hiatus here as we recovered from our Halloween festivities with Ha Ha.
1:21
Halloween, you know, takes a lot out of you when you have to do week to week.
We used to do that for years and overtime.
Life gets in the way and it’s hard to do a weekly podcast.
I know some people do like daily podcasts.
I, I, you know, that’s their job, though, you know, it’s not our job.
1:40
I don’t, I don’t have the stamina.
I don’t think to, to do daily.
But it’s nice to take a little time off and then come back.
And thankfully too, we don’t have to jump right into the, the holiday season.
We’ve got a little bit of time in between, so we thought we would take, you know, this week because, you know, we’ll obviously be doing some sort of Thanksgiving episode, but we wanted to take this week to kind of jump back into the normal scope of the Blood and Black ROM podcast, whatever that may be.
2:12
You know, we do cult films.
We do sometimes we do newly released blockbusters and sometimes we do, you know, random horror movies.
But in this case, we’re also jumping back to a film that we missed out on when it released.
But we we have talked about wanting to do for a while because we’ve done most of his more recent output to him being director Wes Anderson and we missed the his latest movie that he put out.
2:41
And I’m not talking about that new Roald Dahl short that he he released on Netflix or whatever, which I still haven’t seen, but I did I I did recently see the Fantastic Mr. Fox, which was another one of those movies that I think neither of us had had watched before.
3:00
No, just the two handmaiden ones I haven’t seen yet.
I Old Dog and Fantastic Mr. Fox.
Really enjoyed The Fantastic Mr. Fox, that was a that was a fun one.
You know, hits all the right notes of a Roald Dahl film, but no, we’re not talking about those.
3:16
We’re talking about the most recent film that Wes Anderson released to theaters and it was called the Phoenician scheme.
Now, this was 1 like you specifically, you had talked about wanting to do this quite a bit and we we wanted to try to get to theaters, but it’s never really, you know, Wes Anderson movies.
3:36
They don’t really come around us in theaters much.
Especially these days, yeah.
Yeah, for whatever reason, the, you know, while we get some really sometimes strange films in the theatre near us, sometimes the Phoenician, you know, like the the Phoenician scheme did not make it to us.
3:54
And in the most recent past, none of the new Wes Anderson movies have been featured at our local theatre.
So we didn’t get a chance to do it then.
But you picked up the Blu-ray and, you know, you’ve kind of been holding on to it.
Didn’t watch the movie because you planned on us doing this movie at some point.
4:14
So appreciate that, you know?
Yeah.
Yeah, save it for us, you know.
Give it a try, give it the the first viewing as we were talking about on the show and I I didn’t see it either, you know, before now.
4:30
So it’s always good to go in fresh.
And also I do think that though too, it would be interesting sometimes to have seen a Wes Anderson movie and then talk about it after we watch it again.
Because there are times where I do truly believe that multiple viewings is probably recommended, at least recommended for a Wes Anderson film because there’s a lot of things that you can miss.
4:53
You know, stylistically, you can miss a lot of things in the backgrounds.
You can miss some of like the the writing because you’re paying attention to so many details at once.
I think it’s sometimes good to watch it multiple times and be able to discuss it.
5:08
But for us, just like we did with Asteroid City and The French Dispatch, we watched it one time and then we’re going to discuss it.
No research.
We don’t preparation here.
That’s all about the vibes.
5:24
We’re a vibe show now.
That’s right.
That’s right.
And.
Which is funny because I have I have seen Asteroid City two more times since we did the podcast.
I still haven’t revisited French Dispatch, so I might have to put that on the list of things to do.
True, true.
5:40
Yeah, same with me.
I haven’t revisited that one or the Asteroid City since we watched it, but would like to revisit both of them.
So, and I have to put those on the list of collectors items that I would like to have in my Blu-ray disc collection.
6:00
So I do like to collect that stuff, yeah.
Anything else you want to add in the introduction here to the Phoenician scheme or or I think we’ve pretty much chronicled our love of Wes Anderson throughout the show.
6:17
Cause we’ve done a few besides the ones that we just mentioned, you know, his more recent output like the French Dispatch and Asteroid City.
We’ve done a few other ones.
We did the Grand Budapest Hotel.
We did that one for Jeff Goldblum month I believe, right?
No, we did The Life Aquatic with Steve Zizu for Jeff Goldblum.
6:34
Oh, did we?
OK.
We did that one for yes.
Yes, yes.
But we did.
We have done The Grand Budapest Hotel, we have done.
That’s a that’s.
Oh yeah, that’s right, that’s right.
We watched Moonrise Kingdom but didn’t.
Do it for the.
Show didn’t do it for the show.
So yeah, those are I think those.
6:50
Are the that was back in your OG apartment days?
So the show wasn’t up and running then?
Yeah, if you go back, yeah, we’ve done a number of Wes Anderson’s, though, you know, there’s still a bunch that we would like to do and just haven’t had a chance to do but.
We’ll definitely be doing them all because we’re close with big, big fans of this product that he puts out Now.
7:13
I was going to say before we start a beer talk, I wanted to say one of the reasons why I really wanted to do it was the one time that the Facebook algorithm was hitting right when the film was in theaters, I was getting bombarded with the trailer for an ads for it on Facebook.
7:32
So that’s like the one good thing that Mark Zuckerberg’s done this year, so.
Was just, you know, Wes Anderson was shoveling the money towards him.
No, because I mean, it’s they weren’t, you don’t think that you could do that.
7:47
No, it’s just all that algorithmic shit, you know, but.
They knew that you were you were interested and maybe perhaps you had been doing some some researching yourself on the movie and.
Face not even it just popped up like like I like, you know ’cause I, I think they know like from our podcast thing yeah you know taps and sees like, oh, you know so yeah good good for them and it’s also nice too though, like even though like I would like to go, especially now that like finally in my life I have a reliable car like I’ll drive out like 45 minutes all by myself to watch a new West Anderson.
8:26
I don’t mind it you know I don’t give a shit I’ll.
But like it’s nice.
That is the nice thing though, that the turn around for Movies Now is so quick.
You don’t have to wait a year and a half or year for the DVD to come out of VHS.
Like, oh, films out of theaters.
A week later it’s on Blu-ray, you know, so, and now there’s probably some people saying you can just watch it at home.
8:50
Yeah, Yeah.
No, that’s wrong.
Yeah.
And I was thinking too, you know, since we’ve done so many Wes Anderson films, you know, maybe there’s a time in the future where we should be looking into doing, you know, some French New Wave as a as a film month, you know, covering some of the the classic French New Wave that was obviously an inspiration.
9:16
And not just French New Wave either by some of the other, you know, either obvious inspirations or not so obvious inspirations that were certainly precursors to Wes Anderson would be kind of fun as well.
9:32
You know, one that I can think of that I’ve recommended to you after seeing not too long ago is Drowning by Numbers, which was a Peter Greenaway film, which I’ve not seen many Peter Greenaway films.
But from what I’ve seen and you know, Drowning by Numbers, very much in the same vein as Wes Anderson just done very earlier, a much earlier than Wes Anderson, you know, from from the 80s specifically.
10:03
That would be, if you know, kind of a fun little thing to do.
If we.
Yeah, I think interest in it.
I, I, I would, the only new wave film, French New wave film that I’ve ever seen is Pierre Lafoe.
10:20
And the only reason I even kind of looked out for that one was one, because of the Cowboy Bebop episode has nothing to do with it.
But you know, name and two, one of our friends in high school was, you know, a big good art fan.
10:37
So I was like, you know, like in college I was like the one I was able to track down.
But but I would totally be down for that.
I think that see, that would be something fun, unlike this Italian nonsense and, you know, bullshit of centipedes and Donald Pleasants just getting a paycheck.
10:58
So you don’t watch something, you know, artsy fartsy.
There you go, You know, nice and artsy.
That’s what we’re going to do from now on.
Just just artsy movies.
That’s true.
That’s.
The only thing that we’ve got on the docket coming up.
11:16
You know, it’s funny.
I mean, I don’t know how many people would remember, but like way back in the day, like during the early 20 tens on like like late 2000s early 20 tens, one of the reviewers that was on that guy with glasses was a guy that did.
11:34
I was called, his show is called Browse Held High and he would do films that were like that and like review all like that’s how I knew about Antichrist.
That’s how I found out about Antichrist and like a A Serbian Film, you know, ’cause do it like a actual film critique on, you know, the hoity polloi.
11:59
Yeah, all right.
Wow.
Let’s take a break there and jump into what we’re drinking today on the show because I went out and I had to grab something today.
12:14
And, you know, I was surprised to see that our local beer store actually had this.
I’d seen that it was being released, but I didn’t know if we’d get it around us.
Even though it’s, you know, technically a local brewery, we don’t get some of the things that they release, but this one is a a Tate Almagang’s take on their classic Hennepin style, which is a year round staple beer for them.
12:42
And instead of brewing a regular Hennepin style, they took like kind of the base of their Hennepin and they modified it a little bit.
They they added a yeast called Britannamyces, which is used in the secondary fermentation of after, you know, the base Hennepin style to add what they call a dry funky secondary fermentation.
13:13
This beer is called Armageddon.
You know, little take on Armageddon, of course, and they’re calling this a Brett Cezanne ale or a farmhouse style ale.
Now I know both of us are pretty big fans of the classic Belgian styles that Omagang makes.
13:32
Where’s Hennepin in your esteem for Omagang?
It’s probably my top 2 would be that rare Voss.
Those would be the two big ones that I think of that are still out there that I like.
13:50
Yeah.
You know, Hennepins got that big beautiful citrusy coriander, you know, lovely flavour with a nice boozy kick to keep you warm.
It rare Voss has more of, you know, a little bit more of a prettiness to it because it’s a, you know, an amber.
14:11
Those are the two that I like the most.
There’s a lot so to say.
They this is one thing that sucks about them now.
They used to way back in the day.
We haven’t had a chance to, but this bottle reminded me of it because way back in the day when they made their beers, they weren’t doing things like I any IP as you know, they were strictly Belgian styles.
14:37
So they didn’t like the whole OMG series didn’t exist and their beers came basically in one way and one way only and it was like a 24 oz.
If I don’t know if I’m right on the House big it was, but they came in like a wine style bottle with a cork and you know, you and they had like a billion different styles of like Belgian styles that you wouldn’t really ever see.
15:04
Like they’re like they had a Belgian pale ale.
Delightful.
We’ve been chasing that high ever since.
It’s out of it, you know, out of their, you know, their category now, the Abbey Ale, you know, it was like a quadruple with like raisins and stuff and 3 philosophers, which is still around.
15:23
But like so like they had a lot of different styles of Belgians out there that you acquired like that and the Hennepin, the rare Voss.
And, you know, I’m very sad to see that, you know, they’ve moved away from it because it made them, you know, stand out and that, you know.
15:41
Right.
Yeah, now as a little brewery, yeah.
Yeah, that was like a thing they did and it kind of moved away from that a little bit with their OMG series.
Obviously we still get the OMG series, you know, with most of the new releases, but I did really enjoy the fact that they, you know, we’re kind of cemented on the Belgian style.
16:00
I think this, you know, this is kind of a return to form for Amagang with their Armageddon.
Again, it has the base of that Hennepin.
So you really still getting that Hennepin Saison Belgian yeast style?
16:16
The the base of it is very drinkable.
Adding that Brett, Brett Britannamyces yeast I think at, you know, gives it like a little bit more of what they’re calling.
And I kind of agree with.
16:32
It’s like a wild style, like a wild ale type of yeah, almost like a little sourness to it, a little bit of Tang, which I think works really well within that Hennepin base.
I think ultimately it becomes a very drinkable experience, even at 8%.
16:50
Again, this is marketed in single bottles in like AI think it’s a 12.7 oz single bottle with a cork top.
So kind of like a fancy beer serving for this and it’s you know, on the fairly expensive side for one bottle at for they were selling it for 9 bucks a piece where we are.
17:17
I don’t know if that’s market value or what, but kind of expensive.
But again, at the same time, I think this is really, really tasty.
I would definitely try it again.
I think they’ve done a good job, especially if you are, you know, a big fan of a saison or sort of like that Belgian E farmhouse style.
17:36
This is a really nice unique take on it in my opinion.
And how about for you?
I like it a lot.
Again, like the bottle has me because I’m just a sucker for that nice little, you know, wine style with the cork and all that.
18:02
Didn’t you sure it was that small though?
They’re 12.7 oz. 12.7 Yeah, Jesus.
Christ, so poor.
Very poor price point, especially in this economy.
But it is good.
It’s very good.
Very much in vain of the Hennepin, very much in vain of the Cezanne style.
18:22
Big beautiful bright orange citrus pops through coriander, little bit of nutmeg zest to give it, you know, some flavour.
And I will say even though like knowing from looking on the website, it is saying using a pilsner ball.
18:42
You know, I wouldn’t have guessed that just on its own.
But like it does have a pilsner like quality in the fact that the mouth feel and like the light pilsner brightness is is there in this.
It stands out, you know, from a regular, you know say so on.
19:00
So like it a lot got to get a better price point on that.
But you know for especially seeing as in November up here in upstate New York’s come quick and bit us in the ass.
19:16
You know, it is a nice warming beer to have.
So I would say check it out.
And this is, you know, obviously I feel like because because it’s meant to be poured, but I really like the chunky mouthpiece on it, on the bottle itself.
19:34
It’s got a big, big lip on it.
And I kind of like that.
It’s like nice little nice little sipper.
You just want to put a nipple on it and like suck it like a bottle.
What’s right?
That’s right.
All right, well, let’s get into the Phoenician scheme.
19:52
You know, I’ll, I’ll pose this to you.
Where is Phoenicia?
What?
What is Phoenicia?
It’s a lovely little place somewhere in the Middle East.
Yeah.
And the.
Phoenicia is, or I should say was, a real city in ancient times.
20:15
It’s it’s actual location now, or at least what the Phoenician scheme is using it as is kind of up in the air.
But you’re right.
I mean, you can.
You can vaguely pinpoint it as somewhere in the middle.
20:33
East, Well, that’s not what they say.
Like it.
I could be wrong, so if I am, I’m sorry.
I think maybe a city in either Egypt or Carthage.
20:51
Sure, somewhere while while say while you’re talking about that, I’ll take a look at that real quick.
I just think it’s funny, you know, again, because the film, you know, this is kind of a Wes Anderson staple to as to set up some particulars of the plot and then fail to really delve into the detail of them on purpose, right.
21:15
So like the idea of Phoenicia as a city is obviously not something that in terms of the the film spot is really that needed to develop into a, you know, geographical specificity of where it is or similarly.
21:33
And why I kind of wanted to bring that up is that the scheme itself in this movie is both extremely complicated and very much truncated by Wes Anderson’s exposition to the point where it’s sort of like another vague element to the movie where we know approximately about what the scheme is meant to do.
21:57
But the particulars of the scheme are, you know, obviously I’m left out on purpose because it’s not, it’s not needed.
It would elongate the film considerably and it would take away from the whiplash element of, you know, the film jumping back and forth between these various schemes and also the the kind of the surprise of each one of them.
22:20
As we kind of get into the four different areas that he’s working on within the scheme, which I, I actually like quite a bit.
I like the fact that the film leaves this very vague and yet obviously sort of like, I would say like ethereally complicated plot on the outskirts because you know, you, you can see it there.
22:48
You can pinpoint that it’s very complicated and there’s a whole bunch of elements of the business that we just don’t really even get our Privy to.
And I like that a lot.
I think, you know, that’s kind of the, the charm of the Phoenician scheme is that we’re not given all the details about it.
23:04
I don’t know if you felt the same way.
By the way, I saw Phoenicia was in modern day Lebanon.
Yeah, I I think it’s a fun setup.
23:20
It’s a very crazy kooky, what you expect from a modern Wes Anderson film for like a setup, you know, classic style, like vague.
23:35
It does say 1950, but like vague 50s to 60s style look and, you know, very fast-paced, like beats on like what the Hell’s happening?
23:51
Like definitely makes me think of like the French Dispatch and how like it was like so in the Grand Budapest Hotel I was a lot of the information that you’re giving is very, you know, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, you know, fast.
It’s a lot of just fast dot like, not not necessarily the dialogue, but just exposition and.
24:17
Do you think that’s kind of like Anderson’s take two on?
Sort of like the espionage film as a whole?
Because obviously the Phoenician scheme is in cart from the name alone, you know, the scheme.
It is technically like within the espionage vein, and this is sort of like Wes Anderson’s own take on an espionage film.
24:38
To some extent.
I feel like there is sort of like almost a satire parody of the espionage film in that, you know, a lot of those movies have a very quick setups where they’re delivering the audience a lot of exposition all at one time.
24:55
You know, we have to explain who the antagonists are, who’s the, you know, the spy, who’s involved.
You know, there’s double crossings and there’s things, there’s governmental officials involved, and all those things need to be explained to some extent in an espionage movie.
And sometimes it becomes a grandiose sort of like bubbling up of all of these things as they come.
25:15
And, you know, there’s multiple double crossings and there’s triple crossings.
And I think that in some way, the Phoenician scheme is kind of having a laugh at that in that the the scheme is so outlandish, so involved that the film doesn’t even try to explain every Ave. of it because it’s just not worth it.
25:35
But it does give you that overall exposition in that delivery from the, you know, the governmental department who’s been tracking Benicio Del Toro’s character throughout and trying to sabotage his his schemes.
You know they basically give you a whiplash overview of it.
25:53
Sitting, sitting.
I was going to say sitting at like their round table, like they’re the fucking politburo.
But no, I get it’s definitely like like I had and it’s been a long time since I’ve watched like a lot of like spy films, like the 60s and shit.
26:11
It’s definitely like like like in again, Wes does a always does a very hyperbolic take on things.
Like everything’s all constantly over exaggerated because I mean, like it’s definitely you couldn’t consider it like a parody of like the modern James Bond and some films because again, like they’re all like Jason Bourne films where it’s like, I don’t want me an army going out to kill terrorism, you know?
26:39
So it’s like really pleasant to see that.
It’s basically like just some shyster scheme where he’s like out there.
Like, this is how I want to fuck people out of money and make a lot of money doing it.
And, you know, this is my plan that I have to do it.
It’s, you know, real funny.
26:56
And Benicio del Toro’s really great in that role, as, you know, as because he’s so just uncompromisingly bastard and, you know, very robotic and, yeah, inhumane like, and we get to see that throughout the film, like how, you know, just how dedicated to his craft he is.
27:24
Yeah, I think that’s the key is I think, you know, ’cause again, this film is sort of, you know, Wes Anderson is asking us to kind of step into the same shoes as Liesel, which is Benicio del Toro, Jaja’s daughter or supposed daughter in the movie.
27:42
And, you know, because she’s kind of coming in, doesn’t really know her dad very well, knows approximate things about him.
But like, as everybody knows, his life is sort of a mystery and the details of it are kind of kept secret throughout.
And so she is kind of the same stand in for the audience who is coming into this not really knowing much about Zsa, Zsa only knowing about what we’re delivered through exposition about who he is.
28:11
And so it’s interesting to be there and sort of be the same type of character exploring a, you know, a character who potentially is kind of a bad guy, right?
Because the film, you know, while it does take a lot of liberties and as you said, it’s very exaggerated and often sort of like a kind of almost goofball ask at times.
28:36
You know, we’re also meant to think that Zsa Zsa is kind of a bad guy.
He’s been involved in murders.
He says so himself.
He’s, you know, he’s not directly killed anybody, but he’s been involved with violence and, you know, other disingenuous things.
And so we’re kind of following an anti hero to some extent.
28:54
And it’s great to see Benicio Del Toro in this kind of role where he is, like you said, a little bit robotic, has some emotions.
But I think it’s even more interesting to watch him be sort of the almost like a machine like type of person that he is always, you know, thinking about risks, always thinking about like, is there an assassin in the midst around me?
29:20
Because he’s constantly has to worry about, you know, is there someone that he’s worked with in the past who’s like out to murder him and happens multiple times that he picks up since like, hey, I, I know you, you know.
The funniest, I would say the funniest part is about him constantly being like the attempts on his life is the fact that he constantly rides in a plane called like the Jac Jac express.
29:44
Like, you know, it’s like his Dave was like plastered out of the plane and he’s like, how did they find like, you know, it’s it’s his hue breast.
Yeah, exactly.
Because he doesn’t know how to do anything like half measures.
But at the same time, you know, obviously puts him at risk too.
30:02
So it’s it’s it’s really humorous.
I think in the film is again, I would say probably understatedly funny a lot and then sometimes overwrought and exaggeratedly funny.
I think there’s two sides to Wes Anderson scripts a lot of times.
30:18
So, you know, there’s obviously the ridiculous element to it of like just certain, you know, under spoken elements where, you know, again, like the the opening sequence where they they hear a click on the plane and all of a sudden a guy gets blown out the side.
You know, probably one of the most violent scenes that we’ve seen from us, Anderson.
30:39
But he just kind of gets blown out the side.
And, you know, Benicio del Toro has almost zero reaction to it.
He’s just basically like, OK, well, I guess I got to go fly this plane.
Again.
And then like, well, the whole that whole part of the opening is really funny because like he’s out there and the guy’s like, I told you we shouldn’t have done this.
30:56
I told you we shouldn’t have done this.
You know, I’m going to report you to the Trans European Authority on a flight and Bammy never know because you violate this, this and this.
And like a Bond film, he’s like, yeah, bye.
When he just ejector seats around and he’s like, I’ll fly on a plane.
31:14
He’s like, you’re fired.
You guys like what?
Boom.
Like an ejector seat from Goldfinger.
And then he’s sitting there and he flies on the plane crash and burns.
And well, the other funny part about that whole thing is like radio, like I’m preparing to land.
31:29
Where should I land?
There’s a cornfield or a soybean field.
Which one’s softer, undeterminable.
I don’t get Cornfield.
It is, you know, it’s the whole part when, like, he crashes, everyone’s like, Zsa Zsa’s dead.
And he’s like walking through the cornfield and he crabs his, you know, he’s carrying his heart with him and he’s eating like, you know, grabs a piece of corn, starts eating it.
31:52
Like, it’s so fucking surreal, but hilarious.
And, you know, that whole first encounter is what sets up, you know, one of the main themes of the film is because he’s dead for about two minutes, and he’s, like, having his on his way up to heaven.
32:15
It looks like, you know, he’s Benicio Del Toro’s been ripped into the lighthouse.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah and and the whole the whole idea of judgement, you know, judgement over your life and he has to be judged later on refined by Bill Murray.
32:35
So, you know, of course you’re going to be extra special careful for that one.
But yeah, I mean, I, I like, I like the whole setup a lot.
I like the fact that we’re kind of following an anti hero to some extent, you know, ’cause that’s that again, is going to end up being a big part of the theme of the Phoenician scheme as it follows through is the fact that not only is the Phoenician scheme as it’s, you know, the title suggests A scheme, It’s kind of a CD development for this, the little city of Phoenicia where it’s basically taking advantage of the natives there.
33:14
It’s.
Well, nation, it’s the lower liberated W Phoenicia.
Like it’s like so, so hilarious.
Like you know, the naming, you know, scheme for.
And I think, you know, again, I, you know, it, it’s not like it’s benevolent thing that he’s doing.
33:37
He’s basically trying to set up his the rest of his life and his, you know, for for the foreseeable future that he will be funded by the scheme that he’s creating as you are so over the top, so big and so devilish in some regard that it involves slaves that don’t get paid famine, you know, things like this that, you know, basically show how that he’s not good at heart.
34:10
You know this he’s doing it for the money.
And the whole idea is that, you know, this scheme is meant for him to be able to get it funded so that he can be living out the rest of his days rich and then pass that on to hit the rest of his brethren and and kids and such.
34:28
And over the course of it, you know, you’ve come to find out that that’s not really how it’s going to end up working in the film kind of ends on a note where it is obvious that the the whole idea of him being a, you know, a schemer and an entrepreneur kind of gets thrown out the window in terms of philanthropy and benevolence.
34:50
And and I think, you know, again, that’s this film has had some criticism for that.
The fact that it doesn’t, a lot of people found that it didn’t really have much of A of like a plot.
It didn’t really have like a theme, overall theme to it.
35:06
I feel like that’s disingenuous.
I feel like it does have a pretty good theme that runs throughout the movie.
And we’re kind of treated to that, as I said, because we are basically Liesel in this situation.
She is coming in.
She doesn’t really like her dad doesn’t know him, but she thinks that he might have murdered her, her mother.
35:25
And over the course of the film, we see her kind of morph from where she starts, which is attempting to be like the purest nun, you know, wearing a white habit and, you know, constantly, you know, whenever she’s been being subjected to things, you know, praying or, you know, trying to avoid any stimulation.
35:48
And eventually she starts, you know, drinking, start smoking a pipe, which also I, I have to say that white pipe that she has is pretty fucking awesome.
You know, it’s like a Wicker basket pipe.
I love it.
I think it’s pretty cool.
But you know, I love that.
36:03
I would say, I would say I love, you know, any lady that’s walking around, you know, like I have a pipe to smoke and slut.
Yeah, let me take you to the nearest Fuddruckers.
No, I love, I love that though.
I love the the transformation that we see as she kind of goes through and she’s, you know, she starts out as very pure nun.
36:26
And as she’s with her father, you know, she kind of realizes that that strictness of religion is not necessarily the life that she needs to lead either.
And that the same is true of, you know, what her mother Superior says later on.
She’s all well and good to take, keep taking the money from them.
36:44
But she says, you know what?
I don’t really think that you’re so well suited for the the nun life, but if you want to keep funding our Abby.
Church.
That’s fine.
Yeah, that’s.
Fine, that’s great.
I mean, there’s so much to talk about within the setup and schemes of the Phoenician scheme.
37:04
I don’t know that we have a lot of time where that people want us to like kind of run through all of them.
But in terms of the schemes themselves, which are set up very nicely, super organized, love it.
It’s, you know, very much hits my OCD complex of like a nicely organized storyline is the fact that this film instead of some of the setups and the elaborate ways that Wes Anderson structures his other movies like, you know, plays or books, this one is set up with shoe boxes, which are Benicio del Toro’s scheme themselves.
37:40
So he has like various, various shoe boxes that are set aside that have plans for each of the schemes that he has.
And so the way that this film is structured is by shoebox and each shoebox has like part of the scheme in it and that we see.
37:57
It’s great.
I love that.
I love the the organization of it.
It’s so Wes Anderson, especially with like the French shoeboxes that we see throughout.
It’s like it.
Makes it very I think like like it gives it a level of follow ability yeah, that you would see in like the French Dispatch, like it’s going from one scenario to the next like like chapters in a book button, you know, because it doesn’t hop all around.
38:32
So it goes from like one scenario to the next to the next to the next so.
And like very evenly too, because I, I actually, I had to pause the film at like 50 minutes and we were just at like the third scheme, the third part of the scheme.
And I was like, well, that’s so, you know, that’s very evenly toned as well.
38:48
So very nicely organized.
I have to say, very symmetrical in the way that it’s presented as, as a Wes Anderson film should be.
But I what I was getting at is what is your favorite part of the scheme that you know that’s presented to us?
Well, there’s a lot of great parts of the scheme I personally like.
39:07
I, I love the first setup for the scheme when the one I love the whole idea that the scheme is falling apart because the American like government and the agents that are tied to it and the people from different countries that are there talking about how to cripple, cripple Benicio Del Toro is by like, well, rivets.
39:32
We’re going to make these rivets be super expensive.
And so he’s floundering about trying to cover the gap.
And so he gets set.
He goes, they go to Phoenicia and they’re like, oh, we’re going to meet the king and the Prince and we’re going to go into the underground tunnel.
39:54
And they go down there and they run into fucking Tom Hanks and Bryan Cranston as like to California entrepreneurs who are part on the deal.
But you know, they don’t want to cover that part of the gap.
40:12
Like Tom Hanks and Bryan Cranston, like be like 1 Tom Hanks being an asteroid city when we did listen to our review on that inspiring cast choicing by especially in his older age, you know, years now inspired casting because he could totally fit the style and role.
40:33
He’s a very, you know, terrific actor, but also having him be with Bryan Cranston.
Delightful it’s such a delightful scene and that they’re going to solve their business problems with basketball and the most like namdi pamdi 1950s like white guy way of like watch this, you know, like quadruple Juke shot.
40:58
I’m like yeah, a lot to master that one.
You know, I like that whole bit I found to be really fucking fun.
You know, like, I love, I love, I love the whole the basketball scenario.
And it’s funny too, because this film has a number of parallels.
41:20
It was reminding me to escape from LA.
You have.
The.
Che Guevara stand in of the you know Richard Ayoade has is playing that you know the the commando, the communist commando.
We have a basketball showdown event.
41:38
This this film was definitely inspired by escape from LA.
You can’t tell me otherwise 100% see.
That’s the one actor that’s been missing from a Wes Anderson film, his Kurt Russell.
Yeah, Yeah, That is true.
It’s true.
It’s true.
41:54
Where’s Kurt?
Yeah, I think, I think that’s really funny part though.
And I I also like the fact that the gap is literally visually depicted as the gap between the two trains that you don’t like as they ride in on their train, you know, and Benicio Danforo’s coming in on his train and there’s a gap between the two tracks.
42:22
It’s pretty great.
Was by the way too.
I want to be on Tom Hanks and Bryan Cranston’s train.
It looks like they have delightful pilsners and pretzels like Mike Cyrus sitting there, like, you know, you know, risen on our old nun.
And like, do you think you’d ever fall in love with a man like me that’s just kind of risen that I have, you know, and while eating a pretzel and being loud and obnoxious and it’s just, you know.
42:50
Looks like a fun train.
That’s right.
Which is that whole part, which that whole part is hilarious too, because he’s like, would you like a beer?
And she’s like, ah, no, I don’t drink hard liquor.
I’m a nun.
And he’s like, well, it’s not hard laid these right too.
He’s like, son, hard liquor.
It’s just beer and it’s a hot day we’re on.
43:06
This tunnel.
It’s like.
A hot day in a bark tunnel.
It’s a perfect time for a beer.
It’s great.
I would agree.
Yeah.
And that.
Yeah, the whole hard liquor thing comes up again because they offer her like a was it like some sort of wine or yeah, champagne, champagne.
43:24
And they’re like, he’s like, I don’t drink hard liquor.
They’re like, it’s not hard liquor.
Except, well, no, she because she goes like, I don’t drink hard liquor.
I’ve only ever had beer in comedian, comedian wine and beer because like she says that with, like with the, you know, I’ve only ever had comedian wine.
And then then he got like Michael Cera going like, oh, no, this champagne makes you delightful.
43:44
It’s not hard.
Yeah, it makes them seem, you know, nice.
I think it’s great, but you know, I, I think that all of the schemes have a nice, you know, little bit to them.
43:59
But probably my favorite part is actually the callbacks that they do it within each of the schemes of where, you know, they’ve gotten a good deal on hand grenades.
And every single time we meet with somebody else is like, feel free to have a hand grenade and.
They’re like, well, thank you.
Oh.
Thank you.
44:14
I will.
You know, it’s a nice little call back that happens throughout the movie.
What do you think about Scarlett Johansson’s character in here?
Feel like it’s the least flushed out of the.
Yeah, it’s.
That whole skit is very middling, Yeah.
44:31
Like, maybe like Scar Joe found out that they they were making this movie and she’s like, where’s my robots?
And he’s like.
It’s so quick, it’s.
Like I like, like, like I showed my boobs in your last film.
44:47
Yeah.
I just feel like it’s so it’s so yeah, yeah, it’s, it’s too abrupt and it doesn’t really add a whole lot to the scheme.
Like where is the other ones are very involved and, and they have, you know, like probably 20 minutes devoted to each part of the scheme.
45:06
And then you have Scar Joes, who he basically goes in and, you know, there’s a really quick conversation about like, will you marry me?
You know, just for the, you know, for the money, fiduciary value and things.
But, and I, I feel like it just doesn’t add a whole lot to the, to the proceedings.
45:22
It seems like an afterthought and doesn’t you know it’s part, the bit, the the worst part of the scheme, because it doesn’t really add much in the way of detail.
No, it’s just kind of there.
And yeah, I mean, it’s it’s not bad, but like it doesn’t you’re right.
Doesn’t add anything like again, like the Jeffrey Wright bet hilarious.
45:41
Like when they go to his like, like, because Michael Cera has been dedicated to, you know, he’s been tasked withholding all of their liquid currency to rucksack.
And they’re constantly like, where’s the rucksack?
He’s like, oh, I left it in the car, left in the taxi.
45:58
I bet she shouldn’t have done that.
She shouldn’t have done that.
And then like when they’re getting getting rid, like, yeah, he’s like, oh, I left it on the taxi and steer and later drop down.
They’re like, you know, going up under the boat.
And, you know, Jeffrey Wright’s like, come in.
46:15
Hey, come in.
Yeah, come in.
Yeah, you come, come in.
This is going to be great.
Like, you know, it’s real fun.
Like they’re like all those like setups are too.
Because again, like the whole like Casablanca Underground, like, you know, a dance hall that’s getting robbed like, like with is amazing.
46:37
It’s lovely.
It’s hilarious.
It’s they’re all like these nice little fun bits.
I think too, the, the thing that really struck me was just the level of detail of like when they were doing the transfusion with Draffy Wright’s character and you know, Benicio Toro needs the transfusion because he just got shot.
46:58
I love that where there’s just a guy sitting there doing the pumping of the transfusion.
It’s a great like 50s touch.
It’s the attention to detail, you know, from Wes Anderson on some of these things is really nice.
You know, not just in the obvious symmetry of his compositions, which again, you know, there’s nothing you haven’t seen.
47:21
There’s nothing here that you haven’t seen before.
You know, in the Phoenician scheme in terms of near cinematic compositions of how Wes Anderson presents the scenes.
However, it is still very much a beautiful movie to look at and especially like even, which I think was really interesting was the you know, the opening title card sequence where you see the nurses from the top down view with the bathroom floor tiling.
47:49
Is that macro?
And eat cheese.
He was getting tea.
I have no idea.
I don’t.
Know, like when they’re like bringing, like, you know, cleaning his bandages, like we see like the top down and like they’re filling his tub and he’s getting, you know, they’re uncorking wine.
Like they bring him a plate of food and I’m like, is that fucking Mac and cheese?
48:05
You know, I hope.
It like.
This.
Yeah.
It’s like I just, you know, I just fell out of but God damn plain.
I’d better be having some God damn good macaroni and cheese, but.
Yeah, I just, I love that title card sequence though, especially because the way that it’s paired with the font, which is, you know, kind of almost, almost hidden away within the tiling on purpose.
48:28
You know, kind of like thematically like how Zha Zha likes to live his life hidden.
And, you know, I thought that was really nice compositionally and just aesthetically very, very pretty to look at.
And of course, you know, everything aesthetic about this movie is very beautiful.
48:48
I didn’t, I can’t even think of 1 area where I would, you know, say like, I think this is, you know, at this point, Wes Anderson has really perfected that idea of symmetrical composition.
And I think maybe to some extent people are looking for him to kind of, you know, do a little bit of change up for that too.
49:08
You know, like sometimes, you know, and he does occasionally, especially like during like the news report where they’re talking about dead Benicio Del Toro and he comes in from off screen and he’s kind of like in the middle of the the side of the shot.
So you can only see half of them.
49:25
You know, I think things like that offsetting the symmetry is kind of a nice thing that Wes Anderson does stylistically at times to obvious effect.
But you know, I again, at some points too, you kind of, you do kind of wish that he’s perfected this symmetrical composition so much that you would like to see him try to get outside of that occasionally, you know, try something else that sort of offsets.
49:52
And again, there’s a fine line with that too, right?
You know, if you watch a Wes Henderson movie and he doesn’t do that symmetrical thing, you’re like, well, that wasn’t a Wes Henderson movie.
You know, there’s a, it’s almost an authorial thing now, you know, like a signature on a, a painting.
You come to expect it there.
50:07
But at the same time, you know, it would be nice to have him kind of circumvent that a little bit and do something a little bit different at times.
What do you think about the the whole the ending sequence where he confronts his brother Uncle Newbar?
50:25
Hilarious.
Benedict Cumberbatch looks like fucking a very stereotypical, like, racist rat, as you said, Rasputin.
And I said I said, you know, like, shit, I’m trying to blank Foo Manchu.
50:43
Like, you know, his eyebrows are like, you know, very thick and scattered about.
He’s like, yeah, so I have everybody’s blood.
Yeah, that’s.
Great.
I fucking love.
That’s so hilarious.
It’s such.
A like he could be like, he could be a vampire, he could be Dracula, you know, let’s.
51:01
Just it’s a throw away line.
But yeah, because they’re like, you know, he said.
Basically says, you know, you’re not her father.
And he’s like, how do you know?
How do you know?
He’s like, I have your blood, I have everybody’s blood.
It’s ridiculous and he says it again later on during their fight.
51:17
If everyone’s blood.
It’s great.
I I love it.
Benedict Cumberbatch is is great in this.
He doesn’t get a very, you know, big part.
Of course, he only comes in with like the last 10 minutes of the movie remaining, but it is really effective how he portrays Uncle Newbar.
51:34
I also love the fact too, that when Josh goes out and he’s like, basically, I’ll cover it fine.
I’ll use all my money and I’ll cover the gap myself and I won’t get any money from this, but I’ll do it anyway.
And then he gets called back to Uncle Newbar and someone comes and he’s like, Oh yes, Uncle Newbar wants another word with you.
51:52
He goes back in and he’s like.
He’s like, really?
He drops his shit like runs, yes.
And and then Uncle Newbar goes, I’ll do it.
And he’s like I knew you would.
And he holds out the, you know, the clipboard to have him sign his name to still the cover the gap.
52:08
He’s like, not that, not that.
It’s great.
I say, I wouldn’t do that.
I’m just going to kill you myself and start strangling him.
Like I I think like the film would have been pretty cool.
Like if he actually did Franklin to death, like, you know.
Sure.
Like it would have been like a fun little thing of the, the actual especially, especially because we’ll talk about it now.
52:33
Like, we’ll like, so like, what do you think about the whole, like judgement?
And like, the whole, like, every time that we see Jaja on the brink of death, knocking on heaven’s door, we get these flashes of him up and receiving his, you know, the judgement on his life before he’s about to, you know, be sentenced to hell.
52:57
Yeah, I mean, I like the idea.
You just obviously not a new idea of, you know, on the brink of death.
You’re reflecting on your own life and, you know, you might see God.
I think that it again to Wes Anderson typically kind of refrains on commenting about religion to to, you know, I would assume he’s probably something of an atheist himself.
53:22
But I do like the way that the Phoenician scheme deals with religion because obviously a big part of the movie is Liesel, who is a very pious religious figure who kind of learns from Jaja that that’s not necessarily the full extent of life of to be, you know, pious and devote yourself to a God.
53:46
And at the same time, though, they both move further from where they first started.
So, you know, Jaja Benicio del Toro kind of has these visions of whether you really believe that he saw God or if it these are things within his own mind when he’s dying to make him reflect on his own life.
54:05
The idea I think that the film comes back to is that it doesn’t really matter what your religion is.
It matters how you listen to it, how you live out the message of your religion.
So I think one of the more blatant expository dialogues at the end of the film is when Liesel is talking to Zsa Zsa and basically says, you know, I don’t really hear, I don’t hear God.
54:31
Like literally, you know, when when I talk to him, I basically do what I think he would tell me to do.
And I think that’s kind of the key there is that like doesn’t matter if you believe in religion, if you’re atheist, the idea is that you follow the ethical and moral ways that you think you should live your life.
54:51
And I think, you know, that’s that is religion, whether that came literally from a book like the Bible or if it’s just your own internal monologue and religion, I think that the film has a really great message on that, that it doesn’t really matter so long as you’re, you know, you live that internal religion.
55:11
Not only that, well, they say not only that though too, because again, they’re both opposite spectrums at the start of the film.
You know, Zha Zha is an atheist.
He isn’t gear.
He isn’t think about, you know, other people’s needs or, you know, care for others.
55:27
He’s very selfish and he know, but he’s aware of it, that he’s just in it for himself and that he’s cold hearted and he’s just going to live the life that he wants to live.
Liesel is, you know, a nun trying to be get into the seminary, you know, trying to be accepted, and they both throughout the film, through their experiences, move more to a median where you know, mother superiors like you.
55:56
Listen, Leesel, you’ve been trotting around with the God damn golden pipe and, you know, all these, you know, things that aren’t very none are none.
Like of you, you might enjoy, you know, earthly things too much and that’s OK.
56:14
And then the same thing though, for Zsa Zsa of him being like, I’ve been a shitty person, you know, whether it’s through the grace of God that I’m, you know, kind of straightened out, Yeah, I know that I got to be a better person.
And I think it’s a, it’s a good, it’s a good, you know, middle ground of like, you know, like, hey, you can have like these beliefs, but don’t be zealous, you know, in either direction because you’re not going to have compassion if you’re overly pious or, you know, overly agnostic.
56:56
So I think that’s, I think it’s a nice touch for the film.
Yeah.
And like I said, you know, most of the time Wes Anderson refrains from really commenting too much on religion.
I think this is probably one of his more outspoken elements of religion that he includes here.
57:12
And like you said too, you know, especially with the Willem Dafoe, that is very lighthouse ask in.
The whole the whole heaven sequences I was just thinking of like Jesus, this is like he’s making the lighthouse.
57:27
Like imagine like a website.
Where’s he interested?
Presents you’re farts.
You’re fucking farts, you know, lighthouse, just two guys who can’t get along that notes for it.
57:49
I say another robber anger.
So I was also thinking notes for R2 as well.
So, but you know, it’s well, I do think it’s like a nice like, like set up because again, like every time he comes near, you know, Nicio Del Toro comes death, like he’s got a new vision of himself and, you know, on trial in heaven and, you know, hearing and reflecting on things that we didn’t know about him.
58:14
And then him taking that information and giving it to Lee’s alone, saying like, what do you like?
OK, this is like a part of me, you know, about like, what do you think about that?
And, you know, and I think it’s like, it’s just a common theme in the like, I, I think outside of like Moonrise Kingdom, like every film has this incredibly dysfunctional, distant, you know, family fucked up family of.
58:41
Circumstances and not only that, but I really too I like how every time he comes back from the dead after he’s had that sort of vision, he’s always reading a book that’s like sort of vaguely related to it.
Like you’ll see him, you know, on the plane.
He’s always reading a different book and it’s vaguely, I can’t remember the name the titles of all of them now off the top of my head.
59:00
But if you look at the titles of the books, they always have something like vaguely to do with either him coming back from heaven after he’s, you know, had a conversation or some part part of the scheme as well where he’s always doing research on it.
The the book titles are great.
59:22
What else?
Anything else that we didn’t discuss that you want to really want to talk about?
I.
Don’t know that covers it.
I think we’ve.
About covered it.
I mean the The thing is this the film.
Let’s say, let’s say Bill Murray being God like that’s you know.
Great.
Yeah.
59:37
Love it.
You.
Pretty bad.
Bad ass.
One thing I will say is I do think that like like we’ve said previously, especially with the French dispatch and with probably more so the French Dispatch, this film would would definitely be, I think audiences would be.
1:00:00
Better off watching this film again because there’s a lot to miss in it.
While I will say that I don’t think like the theme is over overly complicated.
Like, you know, you can watch it once and you can understand what the theme is going for.
But I think that the things that you miss are sort of the details in the background or the funny parts that you kind of glossed over trying to understand the whole scheme because it can be very whiplash oriented in the way that it delivers dialogue like very quickly, very, you know, just off the cuff.
1:00:34
You really got to be paying attention.
And I think that it would, you know, it really warrants a second viewing just to kind of appreciate some of those other details that you missed.
Even even like the writing on some of the cards that are presented, you know, like when it gives like the latitude and longitude of some of the locations of the of the Phoenician scheme, You’ll notice that there are like pretty funny, like little comments within those that writing that you can kind of gloss over and not really recognize unless you go back and watch it again.
1:01:07
So I would definitely, like I said, I don’t think that the theme is like something that it’s not as complicated as the French Dispatch to kind of parse through, but I do think it warrants a second viewing just to appreciate all those details that you missed.
So yeah, so on a scale of zero to 10, badass, Michael says, transforming from Bjorn into the double double agent, what would you give the Phoenician scheme?
1:01:38
Do it an 8 out of 10.
I like it a lot.
I think it’s really funny.
It’s got that nice dry humor that I appreciate greatly from Wesley Anderson.
I think the plots very fun.
It’s very engaging, keeps, you know, moves along at a brisk pace, keeps you engaged, keeps, you know, keeping your eye on what the Hell’s going on.
1:02:02
Just like any Wes Anderson film.
The cast is amazing.
Everyone does a terrific job, from Tom Hanks to Bryan Cranston to, you know, Benicio del Toro, Michael Cera, Jeffrey Wright, like everyone that is here.
Fantastic job, you know, and I think as a film in Wes’s Canon, it’s middle of the road.
1:02:26
I it might require, you know, another watching like, you know, the cement, but I mean like it’s for middle of the road Wes.
It’s still damn a damn good film.
It looks great, looks beautiful, colors are great, terrific.
1:02:42
The soundtrack is, you know, very understated, keeps the everything you know bound together.
The film’s great, I like it a lot. 8 out of 10.
Just like every Wes Anderson film.
1:02:58
Like your mileage is always going to vary on how much dry comedy you like, but I liked it a lot and if you didn’t, I’m sad for you.
Yeah, I, I would agree with that.
I, I think I would get an 8 out of 10 as well.
I don’t think this is Wes Anderson’s best work or even the most, you know, complex or, you know, Wes Andersony that he’s put out recently.
1:03:22
But that’s not a bad thing.
I don’t think that every film needs to be like the French, French Dispatch, which is, you know, over overly complex, filled with a cast of characters.
I don’t think that’s necessary.
And there it comes a certain point where you just can’t out Wes Anderson yourself anymore.
1:03:39
And I think the Phoenician scheme kind of brings that back a little bit a more intimate cast, a more while it’s, I mean, like, I’m not saying that the setup is not complicated.
It’s extremely complicated.
It’s like humorously complicated in terms of how over the top it is.
1:03:57
But the overall plotting and how it, the pacing and how it presents itself is, you know, I think much more streamlined than some of his more recent output.
And I think that’s a good thing.
1:04:13
I don’t necessarily think that he needs to go in the other direction anymore.
You know, he’s proved that he can do a very complicated and complex assortment of stories.
So I think Venetian scheme, getting back to the, you know, a more streamlined version is, is good.
1:04:31
I really enjoyed it.
I think it’s very entertaining.
I I don’t really see how you couldn’t see.
It’s entertaining.
You know, for about an hour and 40 minutes.
The film just kind of swiftly moves through plot devices, you know, very quickly with the rise sardonic humor that’s very, you know, it’s similar to most of Wes Anderson’s output.
1:04:52
So, you know, the script itself is great.
I think that it’s very still very funny.
All of the cast does a great job.
I think Mia’s Reppleton does a really great job for me not knowing her.
I think she does, you know, an excellent job as Liesl and, you know, overall just seeing familiar faces and everybody sort of pitching in to help with this project.
1:05:14
I think it looks really great.
I really enjoyed it.
And, you know, I think it’s a good middle of the road film in the Wes Anderson output.
So really fun and very entertaining, though it might not, you know, hold as much appeal for certain audiences.
1:05:36
All right, so thanks for listening to our episode on the Phoenician scheme.
I think we’re going to come back in two weeks for our Thanksgiving episode.
Do you have any thoughts on what you want to do for a Thanksgiving episode?
Do you want to do Alice’s Restaurant?
Not really.
1:05:54
I was thinking about it that, you know, we still have to do Alice’s Restaurant.
We still have to do that one.
And I was thinking also there is a movie that goes.
This concert, it’s called Last Waltz.
I was thinking that.
That’s a Thanksgiving movie everyone got that was at the concert, got a Turkey and the amps.
1:06:14
So I was thinking too, we have Black Friday which is the Bruce Campbell movie which released a few years ago now.
Oh, it’s not an Ice Cube Friday sequel.
No, not that one, no, but.
1:06:30
Which they, which they’ve missed out, by the way.
I mean, that’s why.
Yeah, come on.
I mean, that’s.
That’s right.
So yeah.
Well, The thing is, you know what?
OK, you know what?
I’ll concede.
We’ll do Black Friday because you.
I picked this one.
Sure.
So we’ll do.
1:06:46
Black Friday, I was thinking, you know, we could do that when we we haven’t done that one yet.
It’s kind of right up our alley.
And I think it would be perfect for a Thanksgiving episode.
And our episode will release on Black Friday.
So just all around makes sense.
1:07:02
Good, good synergy.
That’s right.
What if we did see Warrior Princess?
Xena Warrior Princess.
Yeah, it has Bruce Campbell on it.
That’s true, but the whole the whole 170 episode run, is that what we’re doing?
1:07:18
What about her?
What about Hercules?
Yeah, that’s how long is that too?
That’s pretty long.
I think that’s even longer, isn’t it?
Yeah, same same amount, six seasons.
Both of them had six seasons.
I bet you if you go back and watch those now, they’re just horrible.
1:07:36
I bet you they’re awful.
Well, of course they’re UPN shows.
They’re they were basically soap operas at a certain point.
They’re just but and I didn’t even realize they also made fucking young Hercules and a offshoot called Sheena as well.
1:07:56
That’s I did not even know that that was the thing.
God, look at Michael Hearst’s hair.
How excitingly blondes, right?
It’s it’s like a like Star Trek Voyager, like a UPNS you.
1:08:15
Know I do find too that when you go back and watch some of these older shows you you just bombarded with how different prestige TV is now like.
Like just like the how after The Sopranos, everyone’s like, oh shit, yeah, can’t just pump out another.
1:08:34
Like this is going on, you know?
Exactly.
All right, well, we will be back in two weeks for our Thanksgiving slash Black Friday episode.
1:08:50
Thanks for listening to our episode on the Phoenician scheme.
Hope you enjoyed it and if you did, you should subscribe to us on pretty much any podcast app you can think of.
We’re on Spotify or home base and we also, you know, we’re on Apple podcast, pretty much any, any place that you get your podcast, we’re on it.
1:09:06
So check this out, leave us a nice review.
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1:09:23
Anything you donate goes back towards beer.
So we appreciate that in advance.
Again, thanks for listening.
Hope you enjoyed.
We’ll see you back for our Thanksgiving episode, and until then.
I know the word Kurt because of Lucy Lawless and Parks and Breck.
So thank you and take care.
